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ContinuousWave Whaler Moderated Discussion Areas ContinuousWave: Whaler Repairs/Mods Gel Coat Patch Paste Won't Cure Over Epoxy search | FAQ |profile | register | author help |
Author | Topic: Gel Coat Patch Paste Won't Cure Over Epoxy |
69boo307 | posted 03-16-2009 04:51 PM ET (US) I purchased some Spectrum Color matched patch paste to repair screw holes on my Striper. I filled the holes with epoxy, plain old two-part stuff from the hardware store. Let that dry for about a week, then scuffed it with 220 grit and scrubbed it thoroughly with soap and water. I've since made four attempts to apply the patch paste, and it will not cure over the epoxy! Not even after a week. It was applied in 80-degree weather. It cures fine anywhere but over the area where the epoxy is. I'm at my wits end with this stuff. I'm going on about four weeks with repairing a few screw holes. I've read all the stuff about the Amine blush and removing with soap and water. I've done all that, ad-nauseum. At this point removing the epoxy would require making a much larger wound than was originally there. Any suggestions? thanks, Brian |
jimh | posted 03-16-2009 07:32 PM ET (US) Try post-curing the epoxy by using a heating gun to warm it. Then repeat your cleaning attempts. Use some acetone to clean, then soap and water. The 'hardware store' epoxy might be part of your problem. Next time use WEST System epoxy. |
Ritzyrags | posted 03-16-2009 07:36 PM ET (US) You may want to consider this; Office for mac 2013. I think that you should remove all the patching material that will not harden first. Next clean the area thoroughly with acetone and take a step back to consider. I think that your problem could be one of two thing; 1- Your MEK is not doing the job it was designed to do. You will remember to use 10 to 12 drops of fresh liquid per ounce of Spectrum product. And to follow the directions to the letter. 2-If the epoxy does argue with the Polyester gel paste; Give the epoxy a barrier coat of primer. I have had great success with the Duratec 1041 grey surfacing primer to isolate epoxy repair prior to re gel coating. Check it out. |
69boo307 | posted 03-16-2009 08:06 PM ET (US) I had not thought of primer, that sounds like a promising solution. I havn't needed to use an ounce of the paste at once, the areas that I'm patching are no bigger than a dime and not deep. Just a small 'dollop' on the end of a kitchen knife does the trick. In the different attempts I made I have used between 2-5 drops of the hardener. |
Tom W Clark | posted 03-16-2009 08:30 PM ET (US) You are probably using too much catalyst. Too much catalyst results in the patch paste not hardening. It seems odd; more should be better, right? Wrong. That the most common error with the patch paste. I doubt the epoxy has anything to do with the gel coat patch paste hardening or not. Adhesion to the epoxy AFTER the gel coat has hardened is another matter but not what we are discussing here. |
Newtauk1 | posted 03-16-2009 09:03 PM ET (US) 'It cures fine anywhere but over the area where the epoxy is' It appears 69boo307 is mixing the paste correctly based on this statement. I would lean towards the base epoxy as the culprit. Perhaps grinding the repair down a bit and applying a coat of polyester resin(and hardener) would also work as a primer. Polyester resin is cheap. |
69boo307 | posted 03-17-2009 07:43 AM ET (US) Thanks for the suggestions. I have some high quality automotive primer (pro quality stuff, not Advanced Auto rattle can stuff), that I might try over the epoxy. Yes, I successfully patched some scratches on the bottom of the hull that involved no epoxy, with the same 'batch' of patch paste I used on the screw holes. That part came out great, it would take a very close inspection to know that there was any work done there. The patch paste is a shade lighter than my original gelcoat, probably just due to weathering. |
SIM | posted 03-17-2009 08:42 AM ET (US) I don't know what brand Epoxy you are using, but I would have to agree with Jim. If you use West system epoxy for a repair and want to cover that repair with polyester gel-coat, the epoxy must be washed with water and sanded before applying gel-coat. If you don't, the blush from the epoxy hardener can prevent the gel-coat from 'kicking'. The blush feels to the touch like a slimy coating after the epoxy kicks. Since I am posting this on the CW forum, some of you may be waiting for an explanation as to why this happens. Sorry....I'm just a application guy. I'll leave the explanation as to why it won't to our resident chemists. :^) Andy |
Blackduck | posted 03-17-2009 08:44 AM ET (US) The best way out for you is to remove some of the new epoxy, and re- fill with System 3 SB 112, surfboard epoxy. This is the only type of epoxy that gelcoat will bond to reliably every time. With other types of epoxies, heating and washing with soapy water does not always work, and I wouldn't waste any more time on any other ways out of this little jam. |
andygere | posted 03-17-2009 10:06 AM ET (US) Using epoxy to fill screw holes is a bit of overkill, and it's a different matrix than the Spectrum patch paste (which is a polyester resin matrix). Drill out the epoxy and use polyester resin thickened with chopped glass fiber or cabosil. You can put the patch paste on as soon as it reaches the 'green' stage, and will get a chemical bond between the poly resin and the patch paste. You can buy it polyester resin premixed with chopped glass in a UV cure paste. If there's not enough direct light to cure it, a few drops of MEKP will get it to catalyze. http://www.solarez.com/products/ Fn 1922 pistol serial numbers a prefix means number. If the Spectrum is hardening on your mixing palate but not in the holes, there's some problem with the epoxy you used. I'm inclined to agree with Tom, if it's amine blush, the Spectrum would harden but not bond, and eventually your plug of patch paste would fall out. |
Paint Legend | posted 03-17-2009 10:30 AM ET (US) SIM is correct polyester gelcoat doesn't adhere well to epoxy for some odd reason (even properly prepared). One of my customers makes smaller racing sailboats and they make a special boat with kevlar and epoxy and over several years most if not all of the gelcoat delaminated from the epoxy/kevlar. Most plastic boat now-a-days are built with Vinylester Resin, this is what many of the boatyards I frequent use for repair as well. It's better than Polyester and not quite as good as Epoxy from what I've been told. Good Luck! Tom |
69boo307 | posted 03-18-2009 09:54 AM ET (US) Thanks again for the wealth of advice. It sounds like I'm just wasting my time messing with this epoxy that I used or trying to cover it up. I've already wasted WAY too much time on what should be a simple repair. I picked up some fiberglass resin, just a can of it with a tube of hardener, for about $11. My plan is to just take the Dremel and grind/drill out as much of my epoxy as I can without making the holes much bigger, the re-do the areas with the fiberglass resin instead, followed by the patch paste again. Does this sound like a reasonable plan? |
tedious | posted 03-18-2009 03:22 PM ET (US) Is it safe to assume polyester resin is compatible with the foam inside Whalers? I know polyester will destroy styrofoam. Tim |
L H G | posted 03-18-2009 05:11 PM ET (US) There are only two reasons I can think of for using Epoxy resin for boat repair: 1. It will not be receiving a top coat of gelcoat, such as when you are repairing stripped out screw holes, such as under a rail base, and the re-installed fitting will cover the polished epoxy surface. I recommend this method for repairing rail mounts. 2. when the boat, or repair, is being painted, instead of being gelcoated. This would apply to either bottom paint areas, or a new Awlgrip/Imron total boat paint job. Otherwise use polyester resin, such as Evercoat #27. Works very well. |
jimh | posted 03-18-2009 09:27 PM ET (US) There is one important reason for using epoxy to make boat repairs: it is a much better adhesive and forms much stronger secondary bonds than polyester resins. |
Tom W Clark | posted 03-18-2009 09:33 PM ET (US) There is no question but that epoxy forms a stronger secondary bond than polyester resin, but if one material is three times as strong as need be and the other only twice as strong, there is nothing to be gained by using the material with greater adhesion. For minor screw holes and little imperfections, epoxy is not necessary and can cause added expense and other problems as described in this thread. |
Newtauk1 | posted 03-19-2009 12:18 AM ET (US) No good reason for epoxy on this repair. Epoxy is more of a problem.Use polyester like Boston Whaler does. |
Ritzyrags | posted 03-19-2009 12:51 AM ET (US) I have personally used a product called; 3M Marine High Strength Repair Filler. It is a 'Unique Vinyl Ester Formulation' Contains fiberglass strands to restore strength when repairing and bonding fiberglass. Cures fast. Easy to use, pre-mixed formulation. For above and below the waterline. http://img13.imageshack.us/my.php?image=olympusphotos347.jpg Now this product will make sure that the damages will be permanently repaired. |
69boo307 | posted 03-19-2009 12:15 PM ET (US) I ground out most of the epoxy and got the fiberglass resin put on last night, and it was nicely cured this morning, so today I will sand it a little and re-try the patch paste. Here's hoping it will 'take' this time. I'll have to post photos of the final result after all this :) |
TransAm | posted 03-19-2009 02:00 PM ET (US) Never had a problem with gelcoat over west system epoxy, even before I knew to wash the amine blush off. |
69boo307 | posted 03-24-2009 09:49 PM ET (US) Here are some photos of the finished product. The successful method was finally using the fiberglass resin to fill in the holes, and the patch paste on top. Go easy, it's my first gelcoat repairs. There were 4 screw holes in each of these photos, you can see some discoloration where the patch paste is slightly different than the original gelcoat. I've sanded these with 1500 grit paper, but I havn't yet done a final polish and wax over it. http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/ KbpK0hu_WOZ9jbRXMEWA3g?feat=directlink |
Topic: Spectrum Gel Coat Patch Paste Repair Kit. Binkster: posted 09:45 PM ET (US). It would be more accurate than using color chips from the paint store. I was not happy with the color of the Spectrum Paste repair kit, basically bondo. I'll live with it though, I made only a couple of repairs on the hull, most on the transom, but. Apr 18, 2020 Details about Spectrum Color Patch Paste Gel Coat Repair See original listing. Spectrum Color Patch Paste Gel Coat Repair: Condition: New. Ended: Apr 18, 2020. Price: US $19.50. Shipping: $5.95 Flat Rate Freight See details. Item location: Quincy, Illinois, United States. Seller: jjboat05. Patch Paste Repair Kit Patch Paste is an easy to use kit for repairing gel coat. Each kit is made up from the factory color gel coat made into a paste, Catalyst & Instructions. Below are additional instructions to assist you. Prep the area removing all of the damaged gel coat Keep the repair as. All air shipments must be placed by 12:00 PM EST to guarantee they will ship same day.
Spectrum Gel Coat Patch Paste
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Hi all. There are some dings in my boat hull that I'd like to repair, the largest of which can be seen in the image below (approx. 1/2-inch length). I plan on progressively wet sanding the entire gel coat portion of the hull (600, 800, 1000 grit) and waxing afterward but want to make this repair first.Purchase our Licensed Version- which adds many more features!
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I was thinking of using Boston Whaler, 1989-1993, White Color Boat Gel Coat Patch Paste Repair Kit - Spectrum Color. I was wondering if the community has any experience with it. I'm also seeking alternate methods, if there are better ones out there.
When doing minor gel coat repairs as well as filling larger scratches I mix Evercoat polyster gel paste 60/40 mixed in with raw liquid Spectrum Gel Coat. 60 Evercoat and 40 raw gel coat. Since the Evercoat product is clear it takes the color of the Spectrum products easily and provides you with a lot filler with out running through a lot of the.
Product: Boston Whaler, 1989-1993, White Color Boat Gel Coat Patch Paste Repair Kit - Spectrum Color